New rules and regs from CPCS

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Martyn Henley
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New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #1 by Martyn Henley » Tue Sep 27, 2011 4:47 pm

I have been following with some interest Ian Simpson's trip to the CPCS conference ... here is his report from that conference
Wow,
Where do I start with this one?
The room was nearly full.
There were 4 reps from the CPCS, and people from the CPA, HSE and the Unions.
The rest appeared to be from CPCS training centres and possibly a few people who walked into the wrong room ad were too polite to walk back out again.
I fear I was the only plant operator in the room.
The they began by telling us who’s who and how Pye Tait have done lots of research. (I have never heard of them either)
Then down to the nitty gritty!
We were told about new things to come.
I think the most prevalent was this knew list of questions to test our attitude on site involving imaginary scenarios with a guy called Bob who is put in a situation where his boss tells him to do unsafe things.
The rest of it was the usual tat but the most worrying to me were related to slingers and 360 operators.
The Slinger/Banksmans ticket is to be subdivided into 5 separate categories which I can only see causing all sorts of problems to the guys on site.
Personally I would have just the one ticket and incorporate 5 modules so when you get a Slinger/Banksman you know he can do the lot.
What’s more worrying to myself is that the 360 ticket is to be split yet again so you will now need separate additions to work in demolition and if you use the machine as a crane.
I can just imagine the scenario when a machine driver refuses to lift something because he hasn’t got that on his ticket.
Then my hopes were slightly raised when a guy called Pete Brown started his speech. (He seemed to be a bit more clued up)
He touched on the idea of using something similar to the operators log book with something like mini modules for different types of operation that could be signed off and add towards you NVQ.
He didn’t specify who would sign these off but it seems reasonable to assume it would be someone in management on site.
Then my alarm bells rang.
Wasn’t the prevention of site management deciding who could do what on site the original reason for the CITB and CSkills?
To give us a viable replacement for this practise as it was deemed management could not be trusted?
Then the Chairman stood up and asked for question.
I was quite suprising that out of a room of nearly 50 people there were only 5 of us who had questions.
I’m afraid to say I was my usual self and hogged the show.
Firstly I questioned the Bob scenario’s explaining how most workers are employed through agencies and when Bob say’s “I’m not doing it” and gets sacked what can the CPCS do to help Bob?
He turned white and basically said “We can’t help you there”
I said “Well your telling us to do things that keep getting us sacked”
Same answer.
Then I asked about the 27,000 men I know who were made unemployable because they lied to the Major Contractors Group.
Can you believe he had the front to say “I think were beyond that now”
I continued to give him bloody awkward questions until some numb nuts suggested he gave me his email address so we could continue without wasting other people’s time.
The irony was when he asked “Has anyone else any questions” there was a deadly silence.
I was going to rip him to bits for at least another hour.
The conference ended pretty soon after.
The only thing i can devise from this conference is that they don’t care about plant operators, they are not interested in our well being or respect the fact we have any intelligence at all.
They want to segregate our working limits NOT because we are incompetent at our jobs but because they are incompetent at finding a way to measure us.
This also benefits everyone who was at that conference (Besides myself) because they sustain their income.
This can only head the industry on a downward slope.
They are talking to everyone apart from the people that matter.
The CPCS should be talking to organ grinder and not the monkeys in shirts!


It gets worse dont it.
Martyn


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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #2 by martyn williams » Tue Sep 27, 2011 4:56 pm

:dizzy: Thats why the construction game is screwed up with ballcocks from those people.
"Weeeer doooomed " as private Frazer would say.
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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #3 by jcbjohn » Tue Sep 27, 2011 6:42 pm

As I have said all along it's just a stealth tax !
If you pass a car or HGV test that's it until you reach the age for a medical, an HGV can kill just as easy as an item of plant


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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #4 by Jeremy Rowland » Tue Sep 27, 2011 8:55 pm

This is just a case of "jobs for the boys" and it does rather annoy me somewhat, as a Quality & Health & Safety manager I had to arrange some overhead crane/lifting and slinging training for two new guys who started work at my company, plus FLT for them both.

One put his notice in last week the other yesterday :doh: what a waste of time and money its crap like this that is destroying our industry and much of it is down to insurance companies who are the biggest legal crooks we have next to our politicians. :x

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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #5 by Martyn Henley » Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:14 pm

It has to stop somewhere surely ... who are these people, what drives them... and what if any experience have they had, i mean what happens when ganger man comes over to you and asks can you lift man hole rings into man hole .. sorry mate cant do that, i aint got a ticket for it ...well says the gangerman you aint no good to me, off hire ... no its down the operator to dig into his pockets and fork out for more bull***t ..the ironic thing is the operator has been doing it all his working life safely... there must be something that can be done to stop this crap surely

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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #6 by Jim M » Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:44 pm

What pisses me off about the shirt and tie brigade who come up with these rules have more than likely never stepped foot in any item of plant let a lone operate it. The ticket you get per item of plant is the only way you can get on to it and then you spend a good few year learning your art/trade. Stealth tax on the honest working man YES and NO consideration for him :x :x :x . It's know wonder that not many young people want to operate plant when you factor in cost of training , cards, assessments etc. If i didn't like operating plant so much i would probably chuck my card in the bin and go and work down Tesco's. Surly the people we all work for should stand up and say something aswell as we as operators are there bread and butter,No operators= No business= No Future :( :( :( .

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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #7 by bigkit » Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:29 pm

STRIKE! All ops out and stay out of big site bollox! Its all shite derived to create an industry out of common sense.

Reminds me, a mate went to france in his lorry. He unloaded in a big depot. Hey, he said, your boys dont wear hard hats or high vis! Thats Ok this is France we dont have accidents over here we dont need them! :wtf: :lol:

At the and of the day the employer endorses the ability of the individual, he takes on the responibility through HIS insurance if there is an incident and HE is liable to prosecution if the man or machine is unfit for purpose! The contractor has a duty of care and we all want o avoid injury, death and costly occurances so be SENSIBLE!

:arrrrgh:


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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #8 by Jeremy Rowland » Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:38 am

Yes Clive it needs a general strike to put a stop to all of this crap :thumbup: Part of the problem is down to the following legislations; HASAWA 1974, MHSWR 1999, PUWER, COSHH and LOLER.
These need some serious revision and need to emphasise that safety is down to the individual as well as the employer, technically under HASAWA you ARE also responsible and you could be sued for loss or damage if your employer has given you the required training and a safe system of work.
I am currently studying for a general certificate in NEBOSH and you can see where most of this crap comes from including actual case histories, then just to make things worse still, we have a "sue everybody" attitude that comes from across the pond in the States and an interfering Europe :x
We pay all these idiot politicians and all they can do is come up with more crap like this, its gone too far and needs putting a stop to.

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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #9 by dig deep pile high » Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:17 am

I just wonder if there will ever be any thing sensible to come from the CPCS. They just make things harder and more complicated. I think they sometimes forget the obvious, that you are actually on site because you want to do a job and a sensible days work!
On site assesment by somebody who knows about machines and drivers has to be simple answer?


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Re: New rules and regs from CPCS

Post #10 by Martyn Henley » Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:16 am

I really do fear for the industry, youngsters coming into the industry have no chance at all, and soon the cost of getting all these tickets will outweigh the wages ... perhaps one day into the future the shortage of operators will be dire, then perhaps things might change.

Its was interesting to see what Clive wrote about working practices in France, i mean if they had to put up with the crap that we do they will be blockading every town and city in France with diggers until something is done .... and what do we do, just moan about it.


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