JCB 3C Mk2 KingPost Photos?

[Bonzo200363]

Hello

I'm new to this site, so apologies for faux pas with style, content etc.

I've just bought a 1972 JCB 3CMkII and it has all the maladies you'd expect including zero brakes, zero steering and years of bodges and patch ups.

My biggest (current) problem is the backhoe piping. Around the Kingpost is a mass of mostly leaking poorly fitted hydraulic pipes. They appear to be a bodge up of someone using whatever pipes they had to hand and would fit, regardless of length/diameter.

I wondered if any OCD person out there (I too share that trait, so its not an insult) has detailed photos of a TIDY Kingpost complete with the correct arrangement of pipes? I need to do some serious pipe replacement, and thought I might start out on the right foot replacing the wrong pipes for the correct (in length and diameter) items.

What would be even better (but I know less likely?) is if someone has a schedule of the correct pipe sizes which should be fitted to the Kingpost, ideally with start and end locations? (Not looking for much am I?)

Finally, any hints as to a cheap ( ) source of 3C parts, new and used. I don't really want to source another 3C as a cheap supply of spares, as it will probably have all the problems my new machine currently has!!! (and if I get another, I will only want to restore it too!!).

Any help would be very much appreciated.

All the best and stay safe.

Steve Bonner

[MrF]

Welcome, this any help? its a 3c3 but the same arrangement. I don't know the pipe lengths but it was taken after sorting out a similar mess I inherited. But I broke a 3c2 for spares and could just fish through the hose spares until I found one that matched the ones that looked ok. If you take that plate off that the pipes curve behind on the skid, you can see how they snake from the valve block inside the machine. To get the hoses off the skid side easier, slew the backhoe all the way to that side, take the rear wheel off, chock the frame solidly in case anything lets go and you can access the hose nut from inside the wheel well area. There's only two diameters of hoses in the kingpost area IRRC, the main ones for the backhoe, and the smaller ones for the hydraclamp system as they just need pressure not flow rate.


For the brakes, they are simple mechanical brakes that only act on the rear axle, take out the seat for ease, the cab floor plates ,and they are at the top of the portal axle exposed. Theyre always a bit rubbish but most likely theyre full of crap and need cleaning out/greasing with copperslip on the pivoting parts and can be improved from non existent to just a bit rubbish with nothing more than a bit of attention.

Steering, none at all? have you checked the hydraulic oil level? the steering system uses a separate pump on the motor itself under the diesel pump area, and goes up to a orbital control in the cab that the steering wheel is on, then down to the steering cylinder, but it does share the main machine oil supply.

There's manuals to cover your machine in the download section under the jcb folder.

I'm not holding up my machine as a good example of a Jcb 3c, the above is to get you started till the posher people (sorry, true enthusiasts) come along

[Bonzo200363]

Brilliant info and a great start. Thanks for the tips as to getting access etc. I have been grubbing around under the JCB today (until the rain started and it was too dark to see what I was doing underneath).

I've been taking things easy as I'm aware that lots of bits will be rusted on solid, and rounding a bolt or shearing something won't help. I left it with the fixings I plan to 'attack' tomorrow soaking in a liberal dousing of Scaffold Clamp Oil (even better than WD40 I've discovered and purchasable in 20 litre drums!).

Tomorrow I will continue with a suitable torch and googles, as I was sick of getting rust and dried mud in my eyes as I fumbled around in semi-darkness.

Thanks again for the info. My 3C Mk2 is a typical farmers model. Odd bolts replacing the correct ones, fencing wire instead of clevis pins and even Baling twine keeping (non safety critical) bits in place. I am just hoping that it has been mud going my eyes and not dried Cow S**t !!!!

The whole exercise (no pun intended) has made me realise how unfit and decrepid I have become. Trying to manoeuvre my 18 stone frame around the tight spaces I found myself in despite the extra ground clearance being a great benefit! (Time for a diet fat boy).

Cheers,

Steve

[Bonzo200363]

ps. I was planning to check the hydraulic levels and bought some oil to top up, but the level indicator (Sight Pipe) doesn't appear to be on this machine. Any ideas how I check levels by dipping and where?

pps Attached is photo of my new Toy/Torture just about to be offloaded after its trip from Perth (Scotland, not Aus) to its new Scottish Borders home.

[MrF]

Ah scottish borders, the flag on your profile said norfolk island which I thought is a tiny island well off the coast of Aus and Nz, I was imaging what a fight it would be finding anything for a 3c there and how much post would cost
There's a few places doing 3c stuff in the UK, I like using tractor spares because the stuff always turns up quick, but there's vicary, john charnley and quite a few others. The JCB's of the 3C series until the powertrain 3c3 were based off a tractor skid, so the skid, gearbox, engine etc are based off leyland tractor offerings which helps spares availability.
The sight glass tube is in the front right side of the cab vertical below where the front bucket/loader controls are (well a bit in front). Its just a long clear tube that fits to a spigot on the top and bottom of the tank.
The next problem when you find it is that its often difficult to see the level unless someone has replaced it as hot oil seems to make them really opaque with time. I have on occasion got by with a really strong floodlight and squinting a lot, but when I got that mk2, someone had fitted the snapped off tip of a fishing float inside the tube to give something to focus on when the hydraulic oil discolour's everything, which I thought was a really great but simple idea and is on my todo list. That tube is also pressurized mildly when the machine is running I believe.
There is a position you have to have the front loader/bucket/rear dipper/arm/bucket in to check the hydraulic oil level correctly. I printed that page out of the manual downloaded from here and laminated it and leave it in the cab to remind me because I always forget exactly which bit needs to be where.

If you look at the hoses that are hanging looped that go up into the boom/dipper, its possible on some that they just haven't refitted the hose guide clamps after replacing them though one looks far too long to start with. There are a series of alloy & plastic clamps inside those sections that keep the hoses constrained, and then you can clock the hydraulic connections while tightening finally so they have loops in at the moving junctions to cover movement but don't rub. On my machine, none of the hoses in the rear section were clamped when it arrived, just bits of string or nothing so they just slid about in use.

The cab doesn't look too bad and it has all its glass still & saveable with some tlc also. Looks like a good basis for a project!

[essexpete]

As McF has said the hoses need clamping and also to be the correct length. They pass over each other (from 2 sides) so need to be sitting right to avoid rubbing. The vertical rollers the hoses pass against need to be free as well. A tip for working under and jacked up on the legs is to cut a couple of sleeper type pieces of wood and place them under the bottom rail and on the jack foot. Then lower the machine slightly to nip the heavy wood in place.

[Bonzo200363]

All really useful stuff here guys. Firstly, the flag. When I signed up, there wasn't the choice of a Scottish Saltire (but Wales is on the list?), So opted for the most obscure flag I could choose!!!!

Been getting the 3C (now named 'Chum' after the nickname of a farming family member) a bit closer to fettled.

Found the oil sight tube. Someone has handily painted it JCB yellow, so cannot be read at all, so I will apply Emery paper and TCut tomorrow to try and remove the paint and see how clouded the thing is once the paint is off. The hydraulics greedily accepted 35 pints of oil no problems, but I did discover the system capacity is something like 195 litres! ( ? How many pints?). Let's hope it is now closer to full than empty!!!!

Stripped one side of the brakes and found near untouched friction material with the two faces of the metal 'disks' quite rusted, so I think someone made an attempt at a reline of the brakes without freeing off the linkages or mechanicals first. - what they thought when they still had no brakes I cannot imagine, but it's saved me £89 for new linings!!! - I'm hoping I'll find the same when I strip the other side tomorrow.

Hoses will wait until I can get safely moving, turning and stopping, but coincidentally I did find a hose clamp under the inches of disintegrated cab (rust) on the floor behind the seat. I'm happy to play around with routing the hoses until I'm sure they won't chafe, stretch of kink in use, but will never get them 100% until I go to a show and crawl all over someone's price and joy 3C with a tape measure and a notebook.

My winter project will be building a completely new cab whilst the old one is in a good enough shape to get dimensions from. Not sure if anyone has seen the YouTube clip of the young lad building his own JCB cab from scratch, but I 'll just say its a work of great skill and far better than I could ever hope for.

Thank you all for your helpful and insightful comments. It's nice to know I am in good company and so much interest is still evident in getting coated in grease and bringing things back to life again.

All the best, and keep up the great work,

Cheers,

Steve Bonner.

[gecko.cx]

Found the oil sight tube. Someone has handily painted it JCB yellow, so cannot be read at all, so I will apply Emery paper and TCut tomorrow to try and remove the paint and see how clouded the thing is once the paint is off.

Emery will probably leave the tube even harder to see through.
Suggest paint stripper or oven cleaner (same thing, mostly)

[Jeremy Rowland]

Nice to have you onboard Steve there is a wealth of knowledge on here and a genuine interest in helping each other which is what really counts.

Jeremy

[MrF]

Stripped one side of the brakes and found near untouched friction material with the two faces of the metal 'disks' quite rusted, so I think someone made an attempt at a reline of the brakes without freeing off the linkages or mechanicals first. - what they thought when they still had no brakes I cannot imagine, but it's saved me £89 for new linings!!! - I'm hoping I'll find the same when I strip the other side tomorrow.

When your fettling, dont forget the pedal/pedals itself, they have replaceable bronze bushes on the pivot shaft, and there's nipples all over them, but as you have to crawl on your back under the machine to get to them, I think there's a lot out there that have never seen a grease gun. They're also in in the centre of the skid if you beach the machine on something its not impossible to twist the whole mounting bracket, which causes geometry issues & masses of stiction and problems down the road. The mounting bracket is based on a bit of heavy angle iron with some fitments welded on, so not that difficult to straighten true/make good if it has though.

There is someone on here who can source replacement cab's, not sure if they do a 3c2 one but possibly. The work is really high quality, and if you have a grotty abused old machine like I do perhaps difficult to justify what even the materials would cost to make a replacement, but if I were going for a nice resto it would be quite a interesting option.

My personal pet hate is seeing machines with everything painted yellow including hydraulic hoses/sight glasses/tyres etc, when I finally do get round to putting some paint on mine, the non yellow bits will be masked off anyway.