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Fiat 50 c crawler info

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Ian.Stewart-Koster
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #41 by Ian.Stewart-Koster » Mon Aug 01, 2011 11:36 pm

Thanks, Deas. We appreciate the comments.
What is special about using a spring washer, rather than a plain mild steel washer, in this case, for the welding up to attach a nut?
At the moment, the broken studs have WD40 soaking over them & some of the muck has been vacuumed out, but we can try acetone & ATF - we have a bottle of each here.
Best wishes,
Ian


Deas Plant
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #42 by Deas Plant » Tue Aug 02, 2011 6:04 am

Hi, Ian.
Just looking at your photos, it appears that you might have more trouble getting a flat washer to sit flat around the broken bolt end than you would in getting a spring washer to sit flat. Another little trick that often makes things easier is to bend a piece of heavy wire or a welding electrode double and tack both ends to the washer to make it easier to hold it in place while you are getting it tacked to the broken bolt end.

It might also make a bit of difference if you take a drift and a hammer and give the tops of those broken bolts a few good taps before you weld the washers on them. Just don't try to drive them right through into the sump. (Oil pan for you top-siders with the drawly accents.)
You have a wonderful day. Best wishes. Deas Plant.


Ian.Stewart-Koster
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #43 by Ian.Stewart-Koster » Tue Aug 02, 2011 9:17 am

Interesting day...
The fellow from South Burnett Machinery, the gurus for Fiat parts rang back to say he'd called all over Australia, and there just aren't any parts available that we'd like in the head bolt & head gasket department - in fact no one had parts that would suit it.

Nick managed to undo four head bolts completely out, & broke the 5th one in his enthusiasm, so the rest are sitting in WD40 again & have had a few bashes to try & jar a crack to help the WD40 get in the block.

Do you know if head bolts are some super-special HT steel, or is it likely if we bought some HT bolts with a 16mm dia & 2mm pitch, we could turn them down to make new ones head bolts?
Best wishes,
Ian


Jeremy Rowland
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #44 by Jeremy Rowland » Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:44 am

Ian the head bolts will almost certainly be H/T if you contact a fastener specialist they will be able to help you out, there should be some markings on the head of any bolt that will help any fastener supplier to give you the correct bolts.

Jeremy


Ian.Stewart-Koster
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #45 by Ian.Stewart-Koster » Tue Aug 02, 2011 11:48 am

Thanks, Jeremy - but these particular ones have thread at BOTH ends, and no head.
The bottom end is a M16, 2mm pitch thread, which goes into the bottom of the block, and the top end is an M14, 2mm pitch, onto which the brass 'acorn' nut is done up.

They look like they were turned on a lathe, actually, going by the scratchmarks, and the fillet at the bototm where the 13mm shaft jumps up to 16mm.
It'd be nice if we could just buy 16mm HT bolts & shave them back to suit at the other end. I'm just wondering about what grade of HT.
Best wishes,
Ian


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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #46 by Jeremy Rowland » Tue Aug 02, 2011 1:55 pm

Ian a half decent fastener supplier should still be able to help you out even if there are no markings on the studding, metric H/T studding should be freely available anyway, but talk to a fastener supplier (a decent one who would normally supply engineering companies) and they should at least be able to offer you advice on exactly what to use.

Jeremy


Ian.Stewart-Koster
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #47 by Ian.Stewart-Koster » Tue Aug 02, 2011 2:34 pm

Thanks, I'll do that.
Best wishes,
Ian


Deas Plant
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #48 by Deas Plant » Tue Aug 02, 2011 2:45 pm

Hi, Ian.
Those bolts should be grade 8 or 9, probably 9, and would most likely have been made in the Fiat factory in those days - before 'out-sourcing' became a buzz word. You might like to try the Bolt Factory at Yatala if you can't them nearer to home. I have been told that they make 'specials' to order but you would probably need to send them a sample of a complete bolt.

http://www.startlocal.com.au/industrial/industrialfaste/qld_brisbane/Nut_Bolt_Factory_1683064.html

Hope this helps.
You have a wonderful day. Best wishes. Deas Plant.


Ian.Stewart-Koster
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 2:23 pm
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Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #49 by Ian.Stewart-Koster » Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:48 am

Thanks for the extra help.
Nick has the pistons out-there are two broken oil rings, and one broken compression rings across the four pistons.
The vrankshaft is still on/in, at the moment.
The engine/block is off the crawler now, and standing up on a pallet, sitting on the flywheel end.
We're trying to work on getting the broken head bolts out, as well as the corroded but so far not broken ones.

I've found someone with a production lathe who wanted a favour from me in the signwriting area, and he'll make the new head bolts up for us.
Getting the old ones out is the tender issue...

I'll upload some more photos in a while.

The gear teeth on the outside of the clutch part, which engages with the teeth inside the flywheel are half broken off, too. That is very peculiar.
Best wishes,
Ian


Ian.Stewart-Koster
Posts: 28
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2010 2:23 pm
Real name: Ian Stewart-Koster
Location: via Peranga, Qld
Contact:

Re: Fiat 50 c crawler info

Post #50 by Ian.Stewart-Koster » Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:58 am

P.S. four head bolts have broken off down 'inside'...
They tried welding a nut to one, but it was too close to the edge, or to the sylinder sleeve (I haven't checked) to get a socket over it.
Best wishes,
Ian


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